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Animania - Views from the outside



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Animania - Views from the outside
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Rei_zero
Doraemon


Joined: 09 Aug 2003
Posts: 74
Location: Perth...

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:30 am    Post subject: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
ok.. before I start.
THIS IS NOT ALL MY OPINION!
this post holds the views of a group of people (who I happened to be a part of) as to the good and bad sides to animania.
if you aren't going to read the entire post, please have the courtesy to read the last paragraph before you start flaming / attacking me.

The words written are harsh, but if anyone from the events orginisers wish to clarify why certian things were done, by all means, go ahead. Because as said before, these are the views of a few people who attended.

aggressive go-getter session......


1. Use of space avaliable.
This was a joke, nowhere near the total avaliable area was used to it's full extent. The venue could have been ˝ the size and still taken everything with no issues at all....
exiting on the first day was a joke. You had to go down the the lower level of the town hall and exit through the side door. This made for a long trip if you were at the front.

2. Promotion of other cons/ clubs
not supported in any way whatsoever for advertising of other cons and clubs outside of the state.
I was unable to place the PANIC / JAFWA postcards anywhere in the venue for people to take as it supposudly was a “conflict of intrest”
this is rediculous

3. Games area
this was in a bad layout. Games were scarce (only 3 arcade machines and 6 console games) and the area was too spread out, with half of the bottom floor taken up by the games. Leaving a huge area of open floor.
RPG and card games were not encouraged, a total of 3 tables were setup

4. Panel setup
Most of these were fine, however the madman panel was poorly setup. Slykura did a great job with what he had, but having lost his voice earlier on in the day, he was having a hard time with it. He had no mic as well as bad lighting.

5. Cosplay: There was a catwalk extended from the stage. This would have been a good idea, if not for the fact only half the cosplayers used the catwalk. The ones that did, didn't stop at the end to pose. Most of the cosplayers didn't know where to go after they have finished./ It was evident that nobody had briefed them on what to do before they went on stage. Photography and filming was very hard due to the audience being too far from the stage and dwarfed by the catwalk. But they didn't stop at the end anyway. They had the lights dimmed so even with flash, photography was impossible. We were not allowed to go upto the stage, catwalk or stand in the isles.
6. Condition of venue.
This was terrible. The entire venue was undergoing construction work which severely restricted the access to both the lower and upper levels of the hall, resulting in congested traffic flow between the areas.
By the progress of the works, it was evident that they had been underway for many months, and as such such an issue could have been avoided by changing the venue early in the planning stages.
Food was not permited inside the venue at any time, understandable in most cercumstanses, but for such an event it should be allowed due to the pure number of people who couldn't leave the venue at any stage during the day
7. Competition setup and judging
the judging of competitions was evedently not carried out properly in many cases, eg: the AMV contest. 2 judges is not a reasonable number for selecting winners in such a competition, 3 or 5 is a more acceptable limit if not audience judged. The lower placing videos were better than the one that won, which was a repeat entry, a severe violation of the competition rules.
Competitions were inproperly run / informed about, resulting in confusion as to when / if / where they were being held for both possible competitors and spectators.
Competitions were not promoted in a proper fasion, with many events not known about until they were either a: In progress, or b: finished
8. General complaints
Booth holders in the fanart area were warned that they had to pack up 5 minutes before they had to vacate the room completely.
No copies of the timetable around the venue at all, this made getting to screenings / panels / comps a lot harder to do, because one was forever looking in their bag for the schedule
Nametags were not given out for any pre-reg people, something that left me less than impressed, as it resulted in a less friendly atmosphere amongst the attendees.
Staff weren't very helpful throughout the event, not really offering any advice to anyone who didn't know their way around much.

Section of glory....

1. Screening setup.
Nicely done for the most part, with the main screen in the large hall a good idea and of decent quality.
Use of DVD footage improved the whole experience and resulted in a good look on the large screen.
2. Traders area.
Traders were given a large area where they could setup to sell their products with minimum hassle, resulting in a fast flow of people past the stalls.
Use of local traders was a good idea, as it allowed attendees to be able to go to the stores if they didn't have what they wanted at the convention, also allowed the businesses to spread the word as to where they are located.
3. Artists alley
setup in a good location at the front of the convention, allowing guests to see works before entering the main screening area, which also had the club tables.
Artists were permitted to sell their work if they wished without any hassles.
4. Photo shoot area
this was a brilliant idea, and props to the committee for thinking of it. It allowed people to take good photos of cosplayers with minimum effort.
5. Cloakroom
Another brilliant idea, the setup was well organized, with ID required to get items back, there was little or no delay in dropping off/picking up items.
The staff running it were friendly and efficient at their tasks.
6. Competitions
a few very original ideas for competitions were used, resulting in a whole new experience for attendees to the convention. They for the most part were planned well, with a few problems (see rant above)
7. General props for...
The main screen, the screen was controlled very well, with the person running seeming to give it a life of it's own through the competitions (could have been utilized more though)
The club booths, having them close to the entrance was a good idea, as it help gain interest in the local clubs.
Information desk, good idea, but not really utilized as it should have been.


In conclusion....
Despite the HUGE list of negative points that I have listed, I really did enjoy myself at animania this year, and will more than likely be back again for it.
The negatives were more points that just drove me and a few others up the wall (the section was typed up by 3 people) and they can always be refined and fixed for next year.
One thing I have learnt from my time in places I work is to take feedback such as this as constructive and use it to improve what I do and how I do it. Hopefully this is realized and that it is also used by other events to work for the mutual benefit of the anime community.

In the end I found that it was the people that attended that made the con more enjoyable for me, not the actual con itself, I had a great time, caught up with old mates, made some new ones and all sorts of good memories. All I need is for the con itself it pick up it's game and animania will be a “must attend” con.
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Caloris
Minawa Andou


Joined: 07 Dec 2003
Posts: 523

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I did see some timetables around the place, but they were out of the way and only had the notes for what was happening in the nearby room.


I have other complaints, and have heard of others that are more... problematic then what you've listed, but you've touched on most of them, and if I say any more, bad things may happen.
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vialick
Nia Teppelin


Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 723
Location: Wyong, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Well I think it's a good thing to list the pros and cons so next year they can be improved on.

Animania was far from perfect (which I doubt any cons actually achive) but it did have a big atmosphere of fun. I have a list of possible improvements, but I'll first write it up as an email and CC it here so people (potentially from other conventions) can see what I highlighted as the problems
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Mr Waffle
TEH WAFFLES!!11!


Joined: 18 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
A couple of points I'll add.

1) I overheard plenty of people not knowing how to get downstairs to the shops/games (so I pointed them in the right direction). More obvious signs (in the main hall) would help? Same with karaoke.

2) The guy arranging karaoke was a doofus. He refused to let two of the contestants perform on Saturday, because there "wasn't enough time" (they each had a 1 minute song) and then he proceeded to play charades!?!?! WTF? And he was late, so they couldn't perform during the "proper" time as they were in the cosplay comp.

I think that's about all I've got to add...
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isk8er
Ranpha Franboise


Joined: 06 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr Waffle wrote:
2) The guy arranging karaoke was a doofus. He refused to let two of the contestants perform on Saturday, because there "wasn't enough time" (they each had a 1 minute song) and then he proceeded to play charades!?!?! WTF? And he was late, so they couldn't perform during the "proper" time as they were in the cosplay comp.


... and he yelled at people. And took microphones off them. And if he decided that they weren't singing well enough he took over for them. Confused

Great list there, Rei_zero. Honestly, there were a lot of things that could be improved upon for next year, and you managed to get down most of them. Another one I found was the extreme yellow lighting used during the cosplay - all the cosplayers look like they have yellow skin in my photos.

I was also disappointed by the absence of Tamarket in the vending area. Now, I know this might not be the 'fault' of the Animania organisers but it would be grand to see them there next year. They have much better stock than Cartoon Passion had.

I had a good time, but if it wasn't for the people there I'm fairly sure I would have left somewhere prior to lunchtime and not returned.
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Friezaess
Minawa Andou


Joined: 20 Jul 2001
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
My major quarells with Animania:

*the dance party/concert sucked majorly. The concert had a couple of English anime-related songs, and the singer kept walking off in the middle of them to spend lots of time changing costumes. It seemed more like a boost for her popularity than a decent concert. And the dance party... well, most of the people I asked assumed that it would be anime tunes remixed, but all it was was some techno tune going whilst Vampire Hunter D played in the background. This was a HUGE disappointment.

*Not enough panels. Definatly not enough panels.

*Not enough things going in general. Start up some workshops! Have demonstrations! More things people can do on the day!

*I know I've said this before, but AstroHobby was present, selling bootlegs as usual. Cartoon Passion wasn't escatly piracy-free either. I wouldn't expect this from an Anime convention that seems to be run by clubs. Evil!

*Speaking of which, I read in the Yorokonde newsletter that one of the reasons tehy couldn't get into Animania was because of bootleggers like AstroHobby and Cartoon Passion. This is absolutley disgusting. Legit people are being turned away because scum like the aformentioned vendors, ESPECIALLY AstroHobby, are taking up the area.

*I totally agree with the space factor. So much wasted space! Put some vendors or games in there somewhere! And nametags are good too- makes it more personal.

Despite tha better venue, I think that last year's animania was better than this year's. It had more panels, more vendors, and a sausage sizzle Wink Learn from the past, guys.

I'm seriously reconsidering going to Animania next year if this year's anything to go by. Maybe I should just fly down to Adelaide for AVcon instead. ^_^

Luv and glomps,
~Fri
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Mr Waffle
TEH WAFFLES!!11!


Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 9128

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
isk8er wrote:
Great list there, Rei_zero. Honestly, there were a lot of things that could be improved upon for next year, and you managed to get down most of them. Another one I found was the extreme yellow lighting used during the cosplay - all the cosplayers look like they have yellow skin in my photos.

I was also disappointed by the absence of Tamarket in the vending area. Now, I know this might not be the 'fault' of the Animania organisers but it would be grand to see them there next year. They have much better stock than Cartoon Passion had.

I had a good time, but if it wasn't for the people there I'm fairly sure I would have left somewhere prior to lunchtime and not returned.


Tehehe @ coloured lighting. Finally a chance for the Eggs to be what they want to be! (if you don't get it, nevermind XD)

I somehow doubt Tamarket will be there next year if it's being run the same way, I imagine they didn't go for the same reason quite a few people didn't...
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Paladin_Anderson
Koishi Herikawa


Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 631
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Friezaess wrote:
And the dance party... well, most of the people I asked assumed that it would be anime tunes remixed, but all it was was some techno tune going whilst Vampire Hunter D played in the background. This was a HUGE disappointment.


It was stated very clearly that it would be a DJ rescoring a popular anime, I have no idea where those people got that idea from.

Personally I thought it was awesome and hope they do it again next year!
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Sakuya
Kenshin Himura


Joined: 05 Jun 2001
Posts: 1052

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
isk8er wrote:

I was also disappointed by the absence of Tamarket in the vending area. Now, I know this might not be the 'fault' of the Animania organisers but it would be grand to see them there next year. They have much better stock than Cartoon Passion had.


If you read the Tamarket forums, they have stated their reasons for not going, it was pretty much the fault of the Animania organisers.

On their forums they have stated they wanted to go this year's Animania but apparently the organisers made it difficult for them to do so.
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vialick
Nia Teppelin


Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 723
Location: Wyong, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Paladin_Anderson wrote:
Friezaess wrote:
And the dance party... well, most of the people I asked assumed that it would be anime tunes remixed, but all it was was some techno tune going whilst Vampire Hunter D played in the background. This was a HUGE disappointment.


It was stated very clearly that it would be a DJ rescoring a popular anime, I have no idea where those people got that idea from.

Personally I thought it was awesome and hope they do it again next year!


Yes, I thought it was obvious too...but some people may have skimmed the details and just thought dance party + anime convention = J-pop, not that they are wrong for thinking so.
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Tama^chan
Hajime Saitou


Joined: 25 Oct 2002
Posts: 112
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tamarket had a good time at Animania 2003 and we did have attending Animania 2004 pencilled in on the calendar.

Unfortunately though when the vendors proposal was sent around for this year we thought that the charges were unreasonable given the likely attendance figures (organisers said it would be 5000-10000, we thought only 2000-3000 and it sounds like our estimate was probably closer to the actual attendance). I can't recall exact numbers now, but charges were at least 6 times greater than the previous year, with an additional security deposit of $500 to be paid in addition to the fee, a full 5 months before the event. Unfortunately the con organisers didn't seem particularly interested in any negotiation.

Our costs to ship stock and staff interstate are already substantial on top of vendor fees, and we simply couldn't make the numbers add up to allow us to attend Animania.

At this point it also looks like Tamarket will not be attending next year's convention, given its proximity to Supanova Sydney. We will be attending Supanova Sydney however if you want to see us Smile
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Mr Waffle
TEH WAFFLES!!11!


Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 9128

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tama^chan wrote:
At this point it also looks like Tamarket will not be attending next year's convention, given its proximity to Supanova Sydney. We will be attending Supanova Sydney however if you want to see us Smile


*cough* I get the feeling most people will be doing the same thing...*cough*
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Guu
Doraemon


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
I kind of saddens me the amount of hate that seems to be coming from a few individuals (i'm not directing comment straight at you, Rei_zero). Perhaps people think that just because Animania is now supported by a 'company' that it no longer cares about the fans? Are they forgetting that THE SAME PEOPLE that put on Animania 2002 and Animania 2003 are running Animania 2004?

Rei_zero wrote:

1. Use of space avaliable.
This was a joke, nowhere near the total avaliable area was used to it's full extent. The venue could have been ˝ the size and still taken everything with no issues at all....
exiting on the first day was a joke. You had to go down the the lower level of the town hall and exit through the side door. This made for a long trip if you were at the front.

This first comment sends the warning bells ringing. Do you know what the most common feedback from 2002 was? "You need a bigger venue". The most common feedback from 2003? "You need a bigger venue, and closer to the city". So I listened. To actually hear someone complain that the venue is too big makes me sad. There is no way I could accomodate that many people on a smaller venue, well I could try, but then ALOT of people would complain of the cramped space.
The issue with the exit, well as you know Town Hall was still under renovations.. but i'll return to that later.

Rei_zero wrote:

2. Promotion of other cons/ clubs
not supported in any way whatsoever for advertising of other cons and clubs outside of the state.
I was unable to place the PANIC / JAFWA postcards anywhere in the venue for people to take as it supposudly was a “conflict of intrest”
this is rediculous

I didn't have any contact beforehand for PANIC / JAFWA to setup a stall or distribute postcards. I'm not psychic you know. And we did have a stall for AVCon (AVCon is from Adelaide) so that comment is not true. How did AVCon get a stall? Simple, they asked us.

Rei_zero wrote:

3. Games area
this was in a bad layout. Games were scarce (only 3 arcade machines and 6 console games) and the area was too spread out, with half of the bottom floor taken up by the games. Leaving a huge area of open floor.
RPG and card games were not encouraged, a total of 3 tables were setup

Again, those comments about "too much" room. *sigh*

Rei_zero wrote:

4. Panel setup
Most of these were fine, however the madman panel was poorly setup. Slykura did a great job with what he had, but having lost his voice earlier on in the day, he was having a hard time with it. He had no mic as well as bad lighting.

I admit the Madman panel wasn't thoroughly organised, this is due to some last minute changes that meant the panel was allocated in the last week. I also didn't expect it to be so popular after seeing Madman panel's at other cons such as AVCon and Manifest. So next year we look at how we can make it better.

Rei_zero wrote:

5. Cosplay: There was a catwalk extended from the stage. This would have been a good idea, if not for the fact only half the cosplayers used the catwalk. The ones that did, didn't stop at the end to pose. Most of the cosplayers didn't know where to go after they have finished./ It was evident that nobody had briefed them on what to do before they went on stage. Photography and filming was very hard due to the audience being too far from the stage and dwarfed by the catwalk. But they didn't stop at the end anyway. They had the lights dimmed so even with flash, photography was impossible. We were not allowed to go upto the stage, catwalk or stand in the isles.

This is so different from my recollection i'm not even going to comment.

Rei_zero wrote:

6. Condition of venue.
This was terrible. The entire venue was undergoing construction work which severely restricted the access to both the lower and upper levels of the hall, resulting in congested traffic flow between the areas.
By the progress of the works, it was evident that they had been underway for many months, and as such such an issue could have been avoided by changing the venue early in the planning stages.
Food was not permited inside the venue at any time, understandable in most cercumstanses, but for such an event it should be allowed due to the pure number of people who couldn't leave the venue at any stage during the day

FYI the Renovations to Town Hall were scheduled to be finished in March 2004. Then we were instructed that they would definitely be finished by June 2004. Then we were instructed they might be finished by September.. then maybe sometime next year. Venues such as Town Hall must be booked more than 12 months in advance, so simply jumping ship and using a different venue was way out of the question by then.
Food was not permitted to be brought in by Town Hall's catering policy. We couldn't change that.

Rei_zero wrote:

7. Competition setup and judging
the judging of competitions was evedently not carried out properly in many cases, eg: the AMV contest. 2 judges is not a reasonable number for selecting winners in such a competition, 3 or 5 is a more acceptable limit if not audience judged. The lower placing videos were better than the one that won, which was a repeat entry, a severe violation of the competition rules.
Competitions were inproperly run / informed about, resulting in confusion as to when / if / where they were being held for both possible competitors and spectators.
Competitions were not promoted in a proper fasion, with many events not known about until they were either a: In progress, or b: finished

Please don't invent rules. Our AMV Competition rules NEVER specified that an entrant was restricted to one prize. When I received the results from the judges and saw that one person had won 1st and 2nd place I went back to double check the rules, and we had not specified that you could only win one prize. Now changing the rules at such a late stage would be UNFAIR to the person who had submitted so many excellent videos.

Rei_zero wrote:

8. General complaints
Booth holders in the fanart area were warned that they had to pack up 5 minutes before they had to vacate the room completely.
No copies of the timetable around the venue at all, this made getting to screenings / panels / comps a lot harder to do, because one was forever looking in their bag for the schedule
Nametags were not given out for any pre-reg people, something that left me less than impressed, as it resulted in a less friendly atmosphere amongst the attendees.
Staff weren't very helpful throughout the event, not really offering any advice to anyone who didn't know their way around much.

I was not aware of the short time given to Artist's to packup.
There were MANY copies of timetables around the venue, at useful places such as above and below the stairs. Also EVERYONE who entered had their own copy of the timetable in their Program Booklet.
The feedback we have received is that many people do not wish to wear nametags.
There may have been times when 'staff' (the people in staff t-shirts) were unable to be of assistance. This may have been due to the fact that some of the staff had very urgent business to attend to. The best place for information and directions is the Helpdesk, if there were any other staff that were unhelpful we would like to know (PRIVATELY please).


Section of glory....

Rei_zero wrote:

1. Screening setup.
Nicely done for the most part, with the main screen in the large hall a good idea and of decent quality.
Use of DVD footage improved the whole experience and resulted in a good look on the large screen.

Thankyou, its so nice to hear someone actually praise us for going to the effort of using DVD as much as possible.

Rei_zero wrote:

2. Traders area.
Traders were given a large area where they could setup to sell their products with minimum hassle, resulting in a fast flow of people past the stalls.
Use of local traders was a good idea, as it allowed attendees to be able to go to the stores if they didn't have what they wanted at the convention, also allowed the businesses to spread the word as to where they are located.

The feedback we have had from all the vendors is also very positive. They liked the large stalls as well as the well spaced areas. And from the look of the crowds on Saturday they sure needed it.

Rei_zero wrote:

3. Artists alley
setup in a good location at the front of the convention, allowing guests to see works before entering the main screening area, which also had the club tables.
Artists were permitted to sell their work if they wished without any hassles.

I'm glad you appreciated the layout, it took us many weeks to design a layout that helped accentuate every part of the convention without stuffing anyone into a corner or up a corridor (there was no artist 'Alley' at Animania Wink)

Rei_zero wrote:

4. Photo shoot area
this was a brilliant idea, and props to the committee for thinking of it. It allowed people to take good photos of cosplayers with minimum effort.

This was to combat the low light and crowds in the Town Hall. I hope people made use of it ^_^

Rei_zero wrote:

5. Cloakroom
Another brilliant idea, the setup was well organized, with ID required to get items back, there was little or no delay in dropping off/picking up items.
The staff running it were friendly and efficient at their tasks.

Thankyou, i'll pass this onto the Volunteers Smile

Rei_zero wrote:

6. Competitions
a few very original ideas for competitions were used, resulting in a whole new experience for attendees to the convention. They for the most part were planned well, with a few problems (see rant above)

We are always trying to come up with new ideas. Our Feedback form on the website (www.animania.net.au) is always open for suggestions or ideas.

Rei_zero wrote:

7. General props for...
The main screen, the screen was controlled very well, with the person running seeming to give it a life of it's own through the competitions (could have been utilized more though)
The club booths, having them close to the entrance was a good idea, as it help gain interest in the local clubs.
Information desk, good idea, but not really utilized as it should have been.

The main screen was at it's best yet. It could've been better, apart from the person organising it being slightly too busy Sad
I think the club's really enjoyed their space this year Smile
Can you suggest how Information desk could be made better?

And in conclusion, please don't take any of my replies as an attack on you personally. I'm not trying to start a war here Wink
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Guu
Doraemon


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr Waffle wrote:

1) I overheard plenty of people not knowing how to get downstairs to the shops/games (so I pointed them in the right direction). More obvious signs (in the main hall) would help? Same with karaoke.

With any luck the renovations will be finished before the end of the decade and we'll actually have some decent stairwells and ELEVATORS (yay).

Mr Waffle wrote:

2) The guy arranging karaoke was a doofus. He refused to let two of the contestants perform on Saturday, because there "wasn't enough time" (they each had a 1 minute song) and then he proceeded to play charades!?!?! WTF? And he was late, so they couldn't perform during the "proper" time as they were in the cosplay comp.

The organisers became aware of the actions of the 'Karaoke guy' and attempted to take measures to remove him. Sadly he was very difficult and the Company he was working for was no help either. Rest assured that we will definately not be using their services next year.
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Friezaess
Minawa Andou


Joined: 20 Jul 2001
Posts: 584
Location: A mystical harem of bishies?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Woot! We have an Animania rep here!

*quickly gnarls into Guu about the presence of bootlegged merchandise* WTF!!!

Luv and glomps,
~Fri
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Nargun
Siegfried Kircheis


Joined: 30 Aug 2001
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
Guu wrote:

Rei_zero wrote:

7. Competition setup and judging
the judging of competitions was evedently not carried out properly in many cases, eg: the AMV contest. 2 judges is not a reasonable number for selecting winners in such a competition, 3 or 5 is a more acceptable limit if not audience judged. The lower placing videos were better than the one that won, which was a repeat entry, a severe violation of the competition rules.
Competitions were inproperly run / informed about, resulting in confusion as to when / if / where they were being held for both possible competitors and spectators.
Competitions were not promoted in a proper fasion, with many events not known about until they were either a: In progress, or b: finished

Please don't invent rules. Our AMV Competition rules NEVER specified that an entrant was restricted to one prize. When I received the results from the judges and saw that one person had won 1st and 2nd place I went back to double check the rules, and we had not specified that you could only win one prize. Now changing the rules at such a late stage would be UNFAIR to the person who had submitted so many excellent videos.


Last year at Manifest, someone won two prizes. Not this year, though. I have to agree with Guu on this point.

In general, you can't change the rules once the competition starts. Manifest [ie, me] made a rather horrible misjudgement in making the manifest rules, but I couldn't go back and fix it, because by the time I worked out that a certain decision was absolutely a mistake, people had already been irredemably negatively affected. I *had* to continue with the original rules, or the competition would have been unfair. And fairness is the raison d'etre of competition.

Although I am concerned by having two judges; Manifest had... six, IIRC. Something like that. Quite a few.
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Guu
Doraemon


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Friezaess wrote:

*the dance party/concert sucked majorly. The concert had a couple of English anime-related songs, and the singer kept walking off in the middle of them to spend lots of time changing costumes. It seemed more like a boost for her popularity than a decent concert. And the dance party... well, most of the people I asked assumed that it would be anime tunes remixed, but all it was was some techno tune going whilst Vampire Hunter D played in the background. This was a HUGE disappointment.

The dance party actually went off, it's just that most people had gone home already. Feedback from 2003 said that many people wanted the events to extend into the night, but it is clear from this year that it is simply too late as most people are worn out by 7pm and leave anyway.
And as other people have stated, the Dance Party was clearly stated as being a DJ rescoring an Anime Film. What sort of dance party were you expecting?

Friezaess wrote:

*Not enough panels. Definatly not enough panels.

Which panels were we missing?

Friezaess wrote:

*Not enough things going in general. Start up some workshops! Have demonstrations! More things people can do on the day!

Demonstrate what?

Friezaess wrote:

*I know I've said this before, but AstroHobby was present, selling bootlegs as usual. Cartoon Passion wasn't escatly piracy-free either. I wouldn't expect this from an Anime convention that seems to be run by clubs. Evil!

We received complaints from 1 person over the weekend about Astro Hobby's CD's. We will be talking to them about this. FYI every other convention in Australia that I have seen has bootlegs. We are doing our best to stamp them out.

Friezaess wrote:

*Speaking of which, I read in the Yorokonde newsletter that one of the reasons tehy couldn't get into Animania was because of bootleggers like AstroHobby and Cartoon Passion. This is absolutley disgusting. Legit people are being turned away because scum like the aformentioned vendors, ESPECIALLY AstroHobby, are taking up the area.

FYI at Anime.AU, Yorokonde's Canberra convention they were selling bootleg Wallscrolls themselves. I heard of the CDs being sold by Astro Hobby, but was not aware of any bootleg merchandise being sold by other vendors.
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Guu
Doraemon


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tama^chan wrote:
Tamarket had a good time at Animania 2003 and we did have attending Animania 2004 pencilled in on the calendar.

Unfortunately though when the vendors proposal was sent around for this year we thought that the charges were unreasonable given the likely attendance figures (organisers said it would be 5000-10000, we thought only 2000-3000 and it sounds like our estimate was probably closer to the actual attendance). I can't recall exact numbers now, but charges were at least 6 times greater than the previous year, with an additional security deposit of $500 to be paid in addition to the fee, a full 5 months before the event. Unfortunately the con organisers didn't seem particularly interested in any negotiation.

Our costs to ship stock and staff interstate are already substantial on top of vendor fees, and we simply couldn't make the numbers add up to allow us to attend Animania.

At this point it also looks like Tamarket will not be attending next year's convention, given its proximity to Supanova Sydney. We will be attending Supanova Sydney however if you want to see us Smile


The vendor costs for Animania 2004 were similar to the vendor costs at other similar sized conventions. It has been annoying me the amount of times I have heard the comments that it is the Organisers fault that Tamarket did not attend. The organisers received 1 email from Tamarket stating that they didn't believe Animania 2004 would draw enough numbers to justify the Vendor costs, compared to another local convention's *cough* 8000 people.

It is clear from the responses from Madman, Kinokuniya, Astro Hobby and Cartoon Passion that Animania 2004 was a SUPER EVENT and they all did alot more business than they had ever expected over the 2 days.
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Friezaess
Minawa Andou


Joined: 20 Jul 2001
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Location: A mystical harem of bishies?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Heya,

Okay feedback from Animania! This is good! Thanks for the reply.

Okay, considering bootlegs are a bit of a soapbox of mine, I'm going to start off with that. Once again, I'll use Manifest as an example- they have a strict no-bootleg policy, and I believe I can safley say that there were no bootlegs at their convention. Yorokonde were selling bootlegs at Anime.au? Are you sure about this? I know they seem to be viciously opposed to bootlegs. Might hafta look into that one.

There should be no bootlegs present at anime conventions. Period. Especially ones where so many anime clubs are present. I'm sorry, but Animania has done the wrong thing by allowing bootlegs into their convention. (Cartoon Passion was selling pirated merchandise too. Did anyone see their pins, for example?)

Demonstrations and panels? Well for one, this is the first anime con I've been to in a while with no yaoi panel Wink Perhaps a 'how to draw manga-style' panel *pimps OzTaku*, 'how to avoid bootlegs' or 'tips for cosplaying' panels. Demonstrations? Martial arts demos (they're always popular), tutorials, etc...

Okie dokie, guess I was wrong about the dance party then. But I still stand my ground on the concert beforehand!

Luv and glomps,
~Fri
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Guu
Doraemon


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Friezaess wrote:

Demonstrations and panels? Well for one, this is the first anime con I've been to in a while with no yaoi panel Wink Perhaps a 'how to draw manga-style' panel *pimps OzTaku*, 'how to avoid bootlegs' or 'tips for cosplaying' panels. Demonstrations? Martial arts demos (they're always popular), tutorials, etc...

Thats some good ideas, thanks!
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Mr Waffle
TEH WAFFLES!!11!


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'd just like to add that I appreciated the larger halls, for both finding people (easier to see) and... er... the natural side effect of having many people together in one place at time... *sniffs around*

BTW, wasn't there a how-to-draw panel on before cosplay one day?

Ok... one last point... I haven't really seen much of it, so... THANKYOU VOLUNTEERS! Smile
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Caloris
Minawa Andou


Joined: 07 Dec 2003
Posts: 523

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
Guu wrote:
Rei_zero wrote:

1. Use of space avaliable.
This was a joke, nowhere near the total avaliable area was used to it's full extent. The venue could have been ˝ the size and still taken everything with no issues at all....
exiting on the first day was a joke. You had to go down the the lower level of the town hall and exit through the side door. This made for a long trip if you were at the front.

This first comment sends the warning bells ringing. Do you know what the most common feedback from 2002 was? "You need a bigger venue". The most common feedback from 2003? "You need a bigger venue, and closer to the city". So I listened. To actually hear someone complain that the venue is too big makes me sad. There is no way I could accomodate that many people on a smaller venue, well I could try, but then ALOT of people would complain of the cramped space.
The issue with the exit, well as you know Town Hall was still under renovations.. but i'll return to that later.


The complant has NOTHING to do with the size of the veune itself. The complant is about the USE of that space. You could easily have had more vendors or more things to do down stairs that used upto 30% of the unused space without having any impact on traffic movement.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

2. Promotion of other cons/ clubs
not supported in any way whatsoever for advertising of other cons and clubs outside of the state.
I was unable to place the PANIC / JAFWA postcards anywhere in the venue for people to take as it supposudly was a “conflict of intrest”
this is rediculous

I didn't have any contact beforehand for PANIC / JAFWA to setup a stall or distribute postcards. I'm not psychic you know. And we did have a stall for AVCon (AVCon is from Adelaide) so that comment is not true. How did AVCon get a stall? Simple, they asked us.


Then why didn't manifest get one? I heard they asked.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

3. Games area
this was in a bad layout. Games were scarce (only 3 arcade machines and 6 console games) and the area was too spread out, with half of the bottom floor taken up by the games. Leaving a huge area of open floor.
RPG and card games were not encouraged, a total of 3 tables were setup

Again, those comments about "too much" room. *sigh*


You don't seem to listen very well. Too much empty space. Not too much room in general. The size of the venue was fine. The use of it wasn't.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

4. Panel setup
Most of these were fine, however the madman panel was poorly setup. Slykura did a great job with what he had, but having lost his voice earlier on in the day, he was having a hard time with it. He had no mic as well as bad lighting.

I admit the Madman panel wasn't thoroughly organised, this is due to some last minute changes that meant the panel was allocated in the last week. I also didn't expect it to be so popular after seeing Madman panel's at other cons such as AVCon and Manifest. So next year we look at how we can make it better.


Why wasn't madman given a slot for a panel to start with? It was quite clear months ago that they would be needing/wanting one.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

5. Cosplay: There was a catwalk extended from the stage. This would have been a good idea, if not for the fact only half the cosplayers used the catwalk. The ones that did, didn't stop at the end to pose. Most of the cosplayers didn't know where to go after they have finished./ It was evident that nobody had briefed them on what to do before they went on stage. Photography and filming was very hard due to the audience being too far from the stage and dwarfed by the catwalk. But they didn't stop at the end anyway. They had the lights dimmed so even with flash, photography was impossible. We were not allowed to go upto the stage, catwalk or stand in the isles.

This is so different from my recollection i'm not even going to comment.


I agree with Rei. On sunday there were some people running up to the side of the stage to take photos, on saturday everyone was told if you don't have a seat, go upstairs. On sunday there were people sitting in the aisles. Most of them were "staff" members hovering around the camera in the middle of the room. AND it was one of those staff members sitting there that STARTED the heckling. I know. I was sitting next to that camera. (of course the MC didn't help much with that either)

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

6. Condition of venue.
This was terrible. The entire venue was undergoing construction work which severely restricted the access to both the lower and upper levels of the hall, resulting in congested traffic flow between the areas.
By the progress of the works, it was evident that they had been underway for many months, and as such such an issue could have been avoided by changing the venue early in the planning stages.
Food was not permited inside the venue at any time, understandable in most cercumstanses, but for such an event it should be allowed due to the pure number of people who couldn't leave the venue at any stage during the day

FYI the Renovations to Town Hall were scheduled to be finished in March 2004. Then we were instructed that they would definitely be finished by June 2004. Then we were instructed they might be finished by September.. then maybe sometime next year. Venues such as Town Hall must be booked more than 12 months in advance, so simply jumping ship and using a different venue was way out of the question by then.
Food was not permitted to be brought in by Town Hall's catering policy. We couldn't change that.


So if you were having problems with Town Hall, you should have said so on the website. Especially something like the renovations. There was NOTHING at all about the renovations mentioned anywhere. If you told people about them beforehand, then people would be more understanding about that now. You knew about the problem, yet failed to notify anyone of it.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

7. Competition setup and judging
the judging of competitions was evedently not carried out properly in many cases, eg: the AMV contest. 2 judges is not a reasonable number for selecting winners in such a competition, 3 or 5 is a more acceptable limit if not audience judged. The lower placing videos were better than the one that won, which was a repeat entry, a severe violation of the competition rules.
Competitions were inproperly run / informed about, resulting in confusion as to when / if / where they were being held for both possible competitors and spectators.
Competitions were not promoted in a proper fasion, with many events not known about until they were either a: In progress, or b: finished

Please don't invent rules. Our AMV Competition rules NEVER specified that an entrant was restricted to one prize. When I received the results from the judges and saw that one person had won 1st and 2nd place I went back to double check the rules, and we had not specified that you could only win one prize. Now changing the rules at such a late stage would be UNFAIR to the person who had submitted so many excellent videos.


When I looked at the rules, there was a limit of 2 videos per person. Maybe that was changed.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

8. General complaints
Booth holders in the fanart area were warned that they had to pack up 5 minutes before they had to vacate the room completely.
No copies of the timetable around the venue at all, this made getting to screenings / panels / comps a lot harder to do, because one was forever looking in their bag for the schedule
Nametags were not given out for any pre-reg people, something that left me less than impressed, as it resulted in a less friendly atmosphere amongst the attendees.
Staff weren't very helpful throughout the event, not really offering any advice to anyone who didn't know their way around much.

I was not aware of the short time given to Artist's to packup.
There were MANY copies of timetables around the venue, at useful places such as above and below the stairs. Also EVERYONE who entered had their own copy of the timetable in their Program Booklet.


The few timetables I saw posted on walls were limited to only that one area. The timetables for the main stage area and the screening rooms were hard to see. Only the timetable for the main screening room was on the door. The other was on the door behind the screen in the corridor not used by many people. Maybe there should have been one or two large timetables of everything near the main door and the room detail ones on the main enterance to each area.

The timetable and map in the booklet were quite small and hard to read. I found myself having to strain my eyes at times to read them. The map in the booklet had a marking of how to get to the screening and karaoke rooms from the main hall. Why wasn't there a mark pointing to the way to get downstairs?

Quote:
The feedback we have received is that many people do not wish to wear nametags.


And many people do. I'd say it is about 50/50 on this. I wouldn't mind wearing a nametag, as long as I didn't have to wear it the whole time.

Quote:
There may have been times when 'staff' (the people in staff t-shirts) were unable to be of assistance. This may have been due to the fact that some of the staff had very urgent business to attend to. The best place for information and directions is the Helpdesk, if there were any other staff that were unhelpful we would like to know (PRIVATELY please).


That, or they were being run into the ground due to lack of help, forced attendance times and no time off.

Quote:
Section of glory....
Rei_zero wrote:

2. Traders area.
Traders were given a large area where they could setup to sell their products with minimum hassle, resulting in a fast flow of people past the stalls.
Use of local traders was a good idea, as it allowed attendees to be able to go to the stores if they didn't have what they wanted at the convention, also allowed the businesses to spread the word as to where they are located.

The feedback we have had from all the vendors is also very positive. They liked the large stalls as well as the well spaced areas. And from the look of the crowds on Saturday they sure needed it.


True, the vendors area was better then Manifest, but there could still have been at least another 3 small-medium sized stalls. A small stall between Madman and Kino. If Astrohobby and Kings Comics were moved towards one side (say, a few meters towards MM), and the RPG tables (which I never saw used) on those walls were moved closer to the gaming area, then another 2 medium sized stalls could have been fit in across from Cartoon Passion.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

4. Photo shoot area
this was a brilliant idea, and props to the committee for thinking of it. It allowed people to take good photos of cosplayers with minimum effort.

This was to combat the low light and crowds in the Town Hall. I hope people made use of it ^_^


I didn't see many people use it. I know I asked a few people if they could go in there for photos. I know Sydney2K did, but other then that, I didn't see much use. Maybe because there was only one and it was shoved away into a corner. Most people likely didn't want to walk all the way there from whereever they happened to be. Maybe have more then one.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

6. Competitions
a few very original ideas for competitions were used, resulting in a whole new experience for attendees to the convention. They for the most part were planned well, with a few problems (see rant above)

We are always trying to come up with new ideas. Our Feedback form on the website (www.animania.net.au) is always open for suggestions or ideas.


Animaina Idol: First time I've stayed at a con to watch the finals, but that was mostly waiting to watch the AMVs. There were problems with the contest which have already been mentioned.

Cosplay: Always good to see people in nice costumes. *blush* But again, problems. which have already been mentioned.

Art / Models: I had no idea what the heck was going on with this. I saw the desks to sign up, and some art on display, but other then that, heard and saw nothing.

AMV: Why wasn't there a single time to watch all the AMVs? Not just one or two in between screenings. I would have liked to have seen more from just birdman studios.

Can't say much about the Live Dubbing (was elsewhere getting food), or the gaming (had no idea what was going on with that), but there are problems with the gaming already mentioned.

Quote:
Rei_zero wrote:

7. General props for...
The main screen, the screen was controlled very well, with the person running seeming to give it a life of it's own through the competitions (could have been utilized more though)
The club booths, having them close to the entrance was a good idea, as it help gain interest in the local clubs.
Information desk, good idea, but not really utilized as it should have been.

The main screen was at it's best yet. It could've been better, apart from the person organising it being slightly too busy Sad


Yes, it could have.

Like some of the sick jokes not there? Or not typing into the slide while it was on the screen. (points at spelling errors)


Mr Waffle wrote:
BTW, wasn't there a how-to-draw panel on before cosplay one day?


Nope. I'm looking at the program right now. There was a 3D art workshop on Saturday from 1-2pm (cosplay at 3pm) and there were 2 other art workshops on sunday before cosplay. no panels.
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Mr Waffle
TEH WAFFLES!!11!


Joined: 18 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quite a few people used the photo bit actually, since I was with cosplayers the entire con... there were lines to use it at some points.

Workshop... panel... whoopy. I saw people drawing and talking about drawing on the big screen. Same diff.
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Caloris
Minawa Andou


Joined: 07 Dec 2003
Posts: 523

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr Waffle wrote:
Workshop... panel... whoopy. I saw people drawing and talking about drawing on the big screen. Same diff.


The workshops were not in the main hall. They were in the same room as the madman panel was.

There was a Kawaii panel in the main hall before the saturday cosplay, but that was boring and was putting people to sleep.
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Tama^chan
Hajime Saitou


Joined: 25 Oct 2002
Posts: 112
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Guu wrote:

The vendor costs for Animania 2004 were similar to the vendor costs at other similar sized conventions. It has been annoying me the amount of times I have heard the comments that it is the Organisers fault that Tamarket did not attend. The organisers received 1 email from Tamarket stating that they didn't believe Animania 2004 would draw enough numbers to justify the Vendor costs, compared to another local convention's *cough* 8000 people.


I don't believe that I have said it is the organisers' fault that we did not attend, I am just stating the reasons why we didn't.

For example:

Manifest
2000-3000 attendees (most similar in size to Animania). No international guests. Cost ~$300 for two dealers tables, or $600 for an entire dedicated dealer room (several dealer size options available). Minimal transport/shipping costs because it is our local con.

Supanova Sydney
7000-8000 attendees. International guests. $900 for a professionally fitted booth, plus interstate travel/shipping/accomodation costs for four people.

Animania
2000-3000 attendees (*edit* I note that the Animania website says they estimate that 7000-8000 ppl attended over the weekend. My figures are also based on estimates from attendees and other vendors). No international guests. Minimum dealers' package costs $1100 plus $500 bond payable 5 months in advance, plus interstate travel/shipping/accomodation costs for four people.

People can work out for themselves what seems most reasonable from a shop perspective. With the exception of Cartoon Passion and Madman, the other vendors were all locals so didn't have to factor in the extra travel costs we did. We are nowhere near as large as Madman, so we can't afford to travel to every con there is and we have to make decisions based on economics - simply put, the costs for Animania as it currently stands were not economical for us. It is currently most similar to Manifest in numbers/events, but with costs similar to Supanova. If the costs were lower, we would have attended.


Last edited by Tama^chan on Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:40 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Greoboruri
Nene Romanova


Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 2388
Location: QBN

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tama^chan wrote:
[...] simply put, the costs for Animania as it currently stands were not economical for us. It is currently most similar to Manifest in numbers/events, but with costs similar to Supanova. If the costs were lower, we would have attended.


It seems that Tamarket weren’t the only ones who decided it just wasn’t worth the money and effort to go. Talking with the owner of a fairly big Australian online anime shop, he basically said the same thing as Tama^chan has.
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Sakuya
Kenshin Himura


Joined: 05 Jun 2001
Posts: 1052

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Guu wrote:

We received complaints from 1 person over the weekend about Astro Hobby's CD's. We will be talking to them about this. FYI every other convention in Australia that I have seen has bootlegs. We are doing our best to stamp them out.


1 person ? I heard several people complained, perhaps a break down in communication between volunteers and organisers here.

Manifest for the past 2 years seem to have done a good job with no bootlegs.

Also how did they manage to sell bootlegs for the 2 days ? I mean sure 1 day give them a warning and tell them not to sell it on the 2nd day.

I appears Animania doesn't really have any direct course of action to stop bootlegs, it's pretty clear when vendors sign the agreement that no bootlegs will be tolerated so Animania are well within their rights to do something about it, yet nothing was done.
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Verandi
Nia Teppelin


Joined: 16 Oct 2001
Posts: 780
Location: the bar.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 4:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
Caloris wrote:

You don't seem to listen very well. Too much empty space. Not too much room in general. The size of the venue was fine. The use of it wasn't.


Well how about you go on 'Empty Space Patrol' next time and make sure there are always people standing in a potentially empty space? You know, you can like...push them in there or something. Or maybe you can suggest something to fill it up? Like milk crates, or a jumping castle or giant slide? They always seem to work. Rolling Eyes

I mean, for I'M TOO DUMB TO FIND OTHER WORDS TO USE SO I USE THE F WORD's sake, you can't have every square metre specifically designed to avoid open areas. You can't plonk a stall in the middle of the floor, and you can't direct which way people go. And who wants a cramped con anyway? It's better to give people room to move.

I thought the size and use of the venue was very good, considering it's a big jump from uni theatres and rooms that most of the cons are held in, which are obviously easier to section off. I can imagine it was tricky working around all that construction bs, but things seemed ok. More signage was definately needed though. The sound carrying was only a real problem at the madman panel.

And people, stop carrying on like you were hardly done by. Large scale anything is extremely hard to run flawlessly, unless you of course have unlimited funding and a bajillion dilligent and hardworking staff.

And there is no point continuing to argue over the pro's and cons. And to say something 'was not properly done'...honestly, think about that.


Edited to stop the **** hitting the fan. I'm in a total bad mood, but I'd rather not stir things up


Last edited by Verandi on Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Rei_zero
Doraemon


Joined: 09 Aug 2003
Posts: 74
Location: Perth...

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
Thanks for the feedback Guu, thats given me a bit of an insight....

Guu wrote:

Rei_zero wrote:

7. Competition setup and judging
the judging of competitions was evedently not carried out properly in many cases, eg: the AMV contest. 2 judges is not a reasonable number for selecting winners in such a competition, 3 or 5 is a more acceptable limit if not audience judged. The lower placing videos were better than the one that won, which was a repeat entry, a severe violation of the competition rules.
Competitions were inproperly run / informed about, resulting in confusion as to when / if / where they were being held for both possible competitors and spectators.
Competitions were not promoted in a proper fasion, with many events not known about until they were either a: In progress, or b: finished

Please don't invent rules. Our AMV Competition rules NEVER specified that an entrant was restricted to one prize. When I received the results from the judges and saw that one person had won 1st and 2nd place I went back to double check the rules, and we had not specified that you could only win one prize. Now changing the rules at such a late stage would be UNFAIR to the person who had submitted so many excellent videos.


yeh.. sorry 'bout that.
I typed that rant up on the same night as I saw the finals.. I really should have looked (normally I'd look at AMV rules, as I ussually enter the comps.. slipped up this time)

I'm not afraid to admit I was wrong there, my apoligies.
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Mr Waffle
TEH WAFFLES!!11!


Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 9128

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
Verandi wrote:
Caloris wrote:

You don't seem to listen very well. Too much empty space. Not too much room in general. The size of the venue was fine. The use of it wasn't.


Well how about you go on 'Empty Space Patrol' next time and make sure there are always people standing in a potentially empty space? You know, you can like...push them in there or something. Or maybe you can suggest something to fill it up? Like milk crates, or a jumping castle or giant slide? They always seem to work. Rolling Eyes


Wuahaha, you win the prize. Hero of the day be you =D1

Obviously Caloris didn't go to Manifest '03 or he wouldn't be complaining about free space in the slightest...
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Mr Waffle
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Animania news page wrote:
Initial estimates place the number of people who entered the convention at about 7-8000 over the 2 days.


Now... not to throw around the term "bold faced lie" or anything, but... isn't that stretching it a *little* bit?
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Nargun
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I would tie Nic Jones to a table and shave him if I thought it could get Manifest more empty space.

This is a personal opinion only, and does not reflect Manifest policy on forcible facial hair removal or space allocation.
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Nic Jones
Doraemon


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
* backs away *

But on the other hand, it'd make quite an event to add to the Manifest line-up.

While I'm here, I should point out that 7000-8000 is not the number of people Animania claims to have had - it's "the number of people who entered the convention" - id est, the number of times someone walked in the door. It's quite an amusing stretch of the English language, in my personal opinion, but it may not be a lie.

Other interesting stretches of the English language include the statement they make on their vendors page:
http://www.animania.net.au/?page=vendors wrote:
Animania 2004 is expected to have the largest collection of Anime/Manga/Game vendors this side of the Pacific!
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Sakuya
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nic Jones wrote:


Other interesting stretches of the English language include the statement they make on their vendors page:
http://www.animania.net.au/?page=vendors wrote:
Animania 2004 is expected to have the largest collection of Anime/Manga/Game vendors this side of the Pacific!


:^o

Wow you mean 5 ? LOL
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Nic Jones
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Now now, it is entirely possible that they expected thirty or so vendors to suddenly decide to lay down the $2150 [1] for a spot a week out from the convention. It may not strictly be a lie, and I think we should give them the benefit of the doubt.

Reference:
[1] $1100 early price + 50% "Last Minute Registration Fee" + $500 bond http://www.animania.net.au/assets/codes/Code%20of%20Conduct%20for%20Vendors.pdf

Edit: Spelling fixed.
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PregnantBob
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
okay, the only thing im not liking about the discussion is this phrase.

"i heard..."

So secondhand information is being used as reasons of discontent? Surely that is as silly as that Nazi camp image.

Nope, i'm not taking sides, it would just be a little more respectful and less gossip queen like to actually have real evidence when dealing with discussion that may affect the reputation of a convention with a good history.

So far the only example has been from Tamarket
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Sonictail
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Just a few quick words from one of the dudes who added to Rei's Rant.
JAFWA and PANIC did not approach Animania for any booth space since it was decided that it would not be worth our time, we only had four people there and we wished to enjoy the convention, not be locked down to a table. We also assumed that like all the other cons that we have attended (anime and otherwise) that there would be a table somewhere advertising other cons and the like. As you all know "Assume" makes a "Ass out of U and Me" and this was proven. However what we cannot comprehend is why we were flatout refused to be allowed to leave our postcards out

Now in regards to the actual Con. Seriously, bootlegs are a major issue, but it only becomes a issue if you buy them. Show your consumer power and don't touch the buggers!

The main hall / artists alley was well thought out so congrats must be had. Having the screening room right down the end was probably unavoidable but dual screens? mad props for that piece of ingenious thinking. Kareoke? seriously what were you thinking?

Downstairs tho, everything seemed to be clumped together, and why have RPG tables if you are not going to organise someone to run a game of BESM or a card tourney? Consoles were well run tho and I was plesantly owned in Smash Bros (my own stupid fault, back into training for me)

Stuff on walls wise... that was serious space that was not well used. Timetables on the walls? Where? All I saw was the advertising for the Madman panel (which is a given at any anime con) but why were none of the other panels advertised? for that matter why wasn't there more panels? Interaction is King!

Oh for the record. Rei and I heard how much Kinokuniya earnt on each day, we'll keep quiet but the numbers would blow your socks off!
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Johnny_forever
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yeah It had some flaws....
but think of it as the pioneering stages of getting anime word out in Oz.... .So next year it will get better but even after all that said it is still a mad time..... and its in the city you can go out through the middle of the day for a break and you can go out at night and have a good one Very Happy
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Luciferian
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
Did anyone see their pins, for example
ARGGGH i got ripped off again if i wanted bootleged CD's id go up to that place we went to before, after dinner on friday night still the cds i did get from astro hobby were all good i love my music im satisfied with that.

Anyways pins wise i got my trigun pins im happy, now begins the fun part about bitching how horrrible Cartoon Passion was.

Cartoon passion lets just say the had 5 thats right 5 plushies in totally yes i counted they didn't stock anymore then that which pissed me off to no extent. Evil or Very Mad Luciferian loves her soft toys.
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Nargun
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sonictail wrote:
All I saw was the advertising for the Madman panel (which is a given at any anime con)


It's not, actually.
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Annie
Lin Minmay


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sonictail wrote:
However what we cannot comprehend is why we were flatout refused to be allowed to leave our postcards out

Ahhh~ if I had known about it I would have gladly offered space on the UTS anime club table! X3
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Juna
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Animania - Views from the outside Reply with quote
Rei_zero wrote:


Staff weren't very helpful throughout the event, not really offering any advice to anyone who didn't know their way around much.



Well they were very helpful to me, I went to the info desk and asked where the screening room was and the guy actually walked me there.
Wink

Oh I agree with Luciferian....not enough plushies!!!
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191200
Usagi Tsukino


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think Animania sucked ... If i had traveled just for the convention I would have been very upset .. I am just lucky that Sydney is just so much fun ^_^

I think people should come down and try out AVcon out of all the conventions I have been at I think AVcon is the best one!!!!

Just a shame that people think anything in adelaide will be crap instantly but come down and check it out !!! even if you are going to just bag it in the end Razz


Woooo AVcon!!!! it is the only TRUE Video Game and Anime convention
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Yea I knew I had a problem when I had a post in each hand, snorting crushed threads off the ass of a twelve-year old boy I called "Madman".
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PregnantBob
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
191200 wrote:
I think Animania sucked


yeah you convinced me to goto Adelaide...the only hole above ground.
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Luciferian
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
Oh I agree with Luciferian....not enough plushies!!!
THANK YOU appart from the bitching of the bootlegs no one gave the credit that there weren't enough freaky plushies....
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191200
Usagi Tsukino


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
PregnantBob wrote:

Adelaide...the only hole above ground.


Pure class ^_^... you bastard Razz thats funny so I cant be pissed off Sad
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Slykura
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
191200 wrote:
I think Animania sucked ... If i had traveled just for the convention I would have been very upset .. I am just lucky that Sydney is just so much fun ^_^

I think people should come down and try out AVcon out of all the conventions I have been at I think AVcon is the best one!!!!

Just a shame that people think anything in adelaide will be crap instantly but come down and check it out !!! even if you are going to just bag it in the end Razz


Woooo AVcon!!!! it is the only TRUE Video Game and Anime convention


yep, AVCON's a at least experience once event. I had a great time this year at the con (bar some things which I won't go into), but socially it's like going to cheers, where everybody knows your name! XD well kinda.
Shame I didn't get a chance to catch up and say hi to you at Animania 191200, kick arse Itachi outfit.
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McSeth
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Guu wrote:

FYI at Anime.AU, Yorokonde's Canberra convention they were selling bootleg Wallscrolls themselves.

and

FYI every other convention in Australia that I have seen has bootlegs.


As president of anime.au.04 I feel that it is my responsibility to respond to this.

Anime.au.04 had a strict non-bootleg policy that was part of the code of conduct for vendors. This was probably the most well-enforced policy of any anime convention held to date in Australia, we even had security guards on hand to handle the ejection of vendors found breaking the code of conduct. Regular checks of all stalls were made by convention staff throughout the day and I am proud to say that we ran a bootleg free convention.
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191200
Usagi Tsukino


Joined: 16 Apr 2001
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Slykura wrote:

yep, AVCON's a at least experience once event. I had a great time this year at the con (bar some things which I won't go into), but socially it's like going to cheers, where everybody knows your name! XD well kinda.
Shame I didn't get a chance to catch up and say hi to you at Animania 191200, kick arse Itachi outfit.


I was there on the sat. I did see you for one second on the other side of the room then I turned around and I didnt see you.. Oh well

About my cosplay thanks ^_^
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Anime Anytime
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
FYI at Anime.AU, Yorokonde's Canberra convention they were selling bootleg Wallscrolls themselves.


Yorokonde: Anime Anytime has always had a strict anti-bootleg policy and we have only ever sold quality, official, merchandise. The wall scrolls we sold at anime.au.04 were legitimate, licensed releases imported from the U.S.A. An inspection of the wall scrolls shows correct copyright information from both the licensing companies in Japan as well as the license holders in the U.S.A (Great Eastern Entertainment). We request that you make an official retraction of your defamatory claim.

Furthermore, we are so sure that we've never, ever, sold any bootlegs at any stage, that we'd be happy to offer anyone who proves to us otherwise a package of anime and manga merchandise worth $1000 delivered to their door.

We had a fantastic time at Animania in the past and we commend the organisers for running such fantastic events. Its good to see the anime events we love grow stronger, bigger, and better (and to see new ones appear!). However at the same time, we urge all convention organisers to remember not to forget their roots in the fan community and get caught up in commercialisation: thereby falling prey to the lure of money from bootleg companies, companies that do not support the anime artists we love.

Its true that it is up to the consumer to choose what they purchase, but unfortunately not all fans (especially fans new to the scene) know what a bootleg is. Thus, although we encourage all merchandise buying fans to educate themselves in the matter (through our constant campaign against anime bootlegs), we also encourage all conventions to enforce a strict non-bootleg policy.
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