Usergroups  ·  Register ·    Profile  ·  Log in to check your private messages  ·   Log in     

Tighter anime laws



Tighter anime laws
Author
Message
wariomona
Lin Minmay


Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Posts: 241
Location: Umm.. let's see ... LOOK! There's a human! You don't see those everyday!

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:19 pm    Post subject: Tighter anime laws Reply with quote
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/getarticle.pl5?nn20050518f1.htm

And about time too![/url]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Reece
Hajime Saitou


Joined: 18 May 2005
Posts: 146
Location: Brisbane

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yup - I made a big US order once and got "La Blue Girl" thinking it would be a bit of light Ecchi --- eeek.

It did serious neurological damage and turned me off anything more "racey" than, say, the Love Hina series.

I wish they would drop the schoolgirl references too - it gives anime a bad image. I always think an Anime characters as being my own age anyway unless specifically depicted as an old person or a small child so the "schoolgirl" reference is lost anyway.

Maybe I would feel different if I was 14 myself - but I am 33 now and the last think I want to be thinking of when watching anime is that the main heroine whose pantyshot was just flashed before me was meant to a high school girl.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
drae
Kenshin Himura


Joined: 14 Apr 2005
Posts: 1083

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Reece wrote:
Yup - I made a big US order once and got "La Blue Girl" thinking it would be a bit of light Ecchi --- eeek.

*giggles*, you should have done a quick 5 second google search. Oh well, you live and learn he he.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Cor
Arumi Asahina


Joined: 15 Dec 2003
Posts: 1735
Location: Nineteen

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Finally!
Hopefully all of that indecent Shinobu material can burn in hell now...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Won't they just do what the western licensors do anyway, and put in 10-seconds of dialogue explaining that the characters are over 18? Sure worked for Onegai Teacher. Mr. Green

Japanese society is (in some areas) so massively screwed up it would take more than this to fix it I suspect. Still, it'd be a good step.

- mib
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Gouki
Vanilla H


Joined: 01 Oct 2001
Posts: 6599
Location: Ballarat

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Reece wrote:
Yup - I made a big US order once and got "La Blue Girl" thinking it would be a bit of light Ecchi --- eeek.


Yeah. The first link of a google search reveals that it's more than 'light ecchi.' Even browsing some message boards would reveal this, if your felt scared by it, you only have yourself to blame.

Besides the big "Absolutely Not For Children" warning didn't give it away?

Still. These sorts of regulations can only be a good thing.
_________________
Give in to the demon inside. It will set you free...
"Shun Gokuu Sattsu!!!"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Mr. Wendal
Cagalli Yula Attha


Joined: 18 Oct 2001
Posts: 2549
Location: Teaching English in Japan

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I never did quite understand the whole schoolgirl fetish thing. I guess it's not limited to Japan though, given the whole "Barely Legal" line of porn that comes out of America.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr. Wendal wrote:
I never did quite understand the whole schoolgirl fetish thing.


I think it has to do with the fact that young women are biologically more attractive. (Particularly in Japan, where the different between "cute" and "homely" is a scant few years.) Some people just take the "young" part and ignore the "woman" part, and add in a dose of "forbidden passionfruit".

- mib
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Greoboruri
Nene Romanova


Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 2357
Location: QBN

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Looking at porn won't make you a rapist. Watching a movie about a murderer won't make you killer. Lolicon wasn't created out of thin air. There was a demand for it, and it was filled by people who wanted to make a profit from it.

Banning it only drives it underground and esentailly going unregualted the product is more demeaning of women and young girls than legal products. Just have a look at illegal porn in any country that has banned it.

Instead there should be more education in schools and young men should be taught to respect women. You can’t go changing a culture by removing the by-products. Groups like “Campaign to Stop the Abuse of Asian Children and to Safeguard Their Rights” always miss the point entirely. Instead of actually attempting to solve the problem they try to get rid of effects of it, which makes no sense and in the long run doesn’t help anyone. Most of the time they just add to the problem.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
RoninAquila
Yakumo Tsukamoto


Joined: 16 Aug 2002
Posts: 2744
Location: Jedi Temple, Coruscant

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I concur. Just because teenagers under the age o 18 engage in sexual activity in films such as Ken Park does not mean that banning it in Australia will make everyone here virgins until marriage.

And hell, even Team America: World Police was bloody going to be rated X in America (Equivalent of "Refused Classification" in Australia) if they did not have a toned-down version of the hilarious puppet sex scene we saw in Aussie cinemas.

We can all get the stuff mentioned above off other sources even before they decide to ban it anyway. Hail the internet!!

Banning anything is only going to rip open the scabs and rub salt into the open wounds. The rivers of unnecessary blood spilt over alcohol in the prohibition era is indicitive of this.

Distributors and senators really ought to stop social wounds from occuring rather than bind wounds after they have happened. That would save everyone a lot of unecessary pain.
_________________

Baby You Ain't Woman Enough To Take My Man!!


-Elliot from Be Cool.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Reece
Hajime Saitou


Joined: 18 May 2005
Posts: 146
Location: Brisbane

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
No-ones talking about banning regular hentai, ecchi or such. People are just looking long and hard as to whether such material should be depicting schoolkids or not.

Animation is "ageless" as in the characters have no age - until you go sticking them in a school uniform on them and say they are in grade school or whatever.

It is this I would like to see less of, and it would not detract in the slightest from anime.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Inniss 1428
Kagami Hiiragi


Joined: 16 Sep 2002
Posts: 3702
Location: Somewhere on Teh Intertubez.

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 4:15 pm    Post subject: ... Reply with quote
My main concern is that people blame the subject material instead of the person, and this has been done for years covering various different areas (such as guns). I would like to take this moment to say:

STOP BLAMING THE ENTERTAINMENT AND LOOK AT THE PSYCHOS WHO ARE DOING THESE THINGS!!!

That being said, I would like to point out that I completely object to the production/marketing of underage pornography in ANY medium, real or otherwise. Reece does have a point that since these characters are drawn, they technically don't have an age. However, once these characters are drawn to intentionally depict underage persons (rather than their young looking age-of-majority counterparts), this becomes totally wrong.
Freedom of expression does have certain limits for the protection of society, and I applaud any effort to bring this industry under control.
_________________
2146316 - The true nature of humanity.
Latest Blant: Relaxed Raiding.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
You pro-kiddy-porn-anime people make me sick. I know some of you are confessed lolicon addicts and I expect nothing better, but I thought the rest of you had more sense.

You actually think animation of graphical sexual acts featuring pre-pubescents is fine? Just because "there may not be any solid evidence that watching it will make you more likely to actually rape a child?"

Pardon me, but if that's your argument you are in need of serious mental help.

For one there appears to be, in Japan, a growing weight of evidence that watching that kind of stuff does make you more likely to commit pedophilia. You say that's because those people already had those tendencies: even if that were true, so what? If by denying people access to lolicon anime we stop them tipping over the edge from fantasy to crime, that sounds like a damn good thing.

Your sick desire to jerk off to lolicon porn is irrelevant compared to the benefit to all of society by not letting you.

You disgust me.

- mib


Last edited by mib on Fri May 20, 2005 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Batou
Hajime Saitou


Joined: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 179
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mib wrote:
Mr. Wendal wrote:
I never did quite understand the whole schoolgirl fetish thing.


I think it has to do with the fact that young women are biologically more attractive. (Particularly in Japan, where the different between "cute" and "homely" is a scant few years.) Some people just take the "young" part and ignore the "woman" part, and add in a dose of "forbidden passionfruit".

- mib


I hate to admit it, but you are probably right there. I had actually noticed that on the times I've gone to Japan. It is pretty rare to see what I'd classify as an aesthetically pleasing adult female, but you would in teens. In Australia it is not the case.

I believe a lot of it had to a lot do with the post war McArthur constitution where there was some censorship stuff to do with seeing pubes. The first time I went to japan, about 11 years ago, I actually checked a US playboy to see if what I'd heard was true, and sure enough, the pubes had all been nikko-penned out. But in regular bookstores you'd see obvious kiddy p0rn book prominently displayed (although wrapped). See, no pubes in kiddy pr0n. But going back over the last, say, 4 years, you don't see it any more, and there is more "regular" pron. So it has been changing for the better.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
drae
Kenshin Himura


Joined: 14 Apr 2005
Posts: 1083

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I’m sick of arguing the banning issue. Ban it. It won’t solve the problem though, it never does, this will only be a band-aid solution at best.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Nargun
Siegfried Kircheis


Joined: 30 Aug 2001
Posts: 4804
Location: \relax{}

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mib wrote:
For one there appears to be, in Japan, a growing weight of evidence that watching that kind of stuff does make you more likely to commit pedophilia.


Almost-but-not-quite-quibble: you can't commit "pedophillia", as it's a mental state. You commit sexual assult and etc; that you *want* to is "pedophillia", but the actual act itself is not properly so called. Being a pedophile is not per se illegal, any more than it's illegal to want to tax raquell welch; the act, not the thought, is regulated.

That said, I am entirely in agreement with you.

With the reservation that eliminating hardcore kiddyporn anime will likely lead to an increase in soft-core pseudoporn fetishisation or implication-only anime; on a purely selfish level, the kiddy-raping stuff is easy for me to avoid, the pseudoporn rather less so. If the truth be told, I think this is already happening.

On a less-selfish level, I'm not convinced that the pseudoporn is any better in terms of outcomes than the overt hardcore stuf. Also, I'm dubious that the pseudoporn can be effectively regulated [or Anne F*cking Geddes would be in jail now].

Ma. Give it a go, I suppose; if it kills the underage ero-games then with luck it'll kill the harem anime and then all the c-list perverts will find something else to do instead of watching cartoons. With luck.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
drae
Kenshin Himura


Joined: 14 Apr 2005
Posts: 1083

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
You know, I feel the need to explain why I’m both against and for banning this, it’s a weird situation. I have nothing against banning this sort of stuff in general, that’s fine. If this sort of thing just started and they said, how immoral or unethical is this, get rid of it we don’t want it, that’s cool, cause it is a little horrid. You know, underage girls, rape, horrid stuff, we don’t want to see it. However, it seems to me that this is a response to the increase of rapes in a society (which I attribute to the lack of proper education, but that’s another topic) so they’ve looked for an easy solution. I have a problem with this. Toting this around like it’s some kind of miracle fix is stupid, and furthermore if they are only banning this BECAUSE they perceive it to be some “miracle” solution, they’re banning it for the wrong reasons. If society was so self-righteous and felt so strongly about the issue, they would have acted sooner, but they didn’t, which raises questions on why they’re banning it. Everyone is saying it's horrid, it's unethical, that's BS! What they really mean is we’ve got a problem, lets ban anything that has a connection to it. They believe they’ll get rid of kiddy-porn anime and the number of rapes will automatically decrease. YES! Why didn’t we think of this sooner, lets get rid of all the racing movies on TV and ban all racing sports while we’re at it, and no one will speed anymore, this is genius stuff!

So yeah, ban it, I don’t care, I don’t think it should have been allowed in the first place. The only reason it is being banned though is that society is floundering for some radical quick fix solution to a problem that is quickly becoming serious. It won’t work though, that’s guaranteed. However I think it’s an amusing situation. This is their last shot, what are they going to ban next if sexual assaults don’t decrease ey? But that’s alright though, with the knowledge that this nasty stuff is out of society, we can all go back to the illusion that we have done all we can and these things only happen because the individuals who commit it are evil and beyond help, or that they themselves were abused as children or that they’re just “naturally” aggressive, or they have ADD, or it's their DNA.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nargun wrote:
Almost-but-not-quite-quibble: you can't commit "pedophillia", as it's a mental state.


I'm not so sure. I admit I struggled to find the right words for the crime I was describing (a sexual crime perpetrated against a minor), but consulting a dictionary lead me to the following definition.

dictionary.com wrote:
ped·o·phil·i·a (n): The act or fantasy on the part of an adult of engaging in sexual activity with a child or children.


It doesn't seem right, but apparently it is. Go figure. (Either that or it's some subtlety of English grammar for which I'm unaware of the rule.)

- mib
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
InGram
Madboard Mod


Joined: 25 Oct 2001
Posts: 3659
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mib wrote:
You pro-kiddy-porn-anime people make me sick. I know some of you are confessed lolicon addicts and I expect nothing better, but I thought the rest of you had more sense.


LOL! Go mib.

Yeah, it's definitely kinda weird to look at the box of an H-game that's obviously set in a kindergarten.

But then you walk down the street and see a mainstream ad for soft drink with a girl on it wearing a school mizugi. :-k
_________________
Shine on, you crazy diamond...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Benza
Banned


Joined: 27 Oct 2003
Posts: 15571
Location: Brisbane

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
ok is it just me or did this line
Quote:
Some experts voice caution about tightening legal controls, saying such measures could infringe on freedom of expression.


Make anyone else laugh? They allready have ridiculousl cencorship laws on their porno their.
And sorry as wrong as the whole kiddy porn thing is (Wich I whole heartedly agree with banning) I find it amazing that they are getting all up in arms over the kiddy porn side of hentai and not the violent rape side of hentai wich is ever so popular.


Quote:
I think it has to do with the fact that young women are biologically more attractive. (Particularly in Japan, where the different between "cute" and "homely" is a scant few years.)


But then again thats a matter larley of taste, one of the biggest pay for porn sites on the net is a Milf site (Mother I'd like to I'M TOO DUMB TO FIND OTHER WORDS TO USE SO I USE THE F WORD) Sorry but I think the term Biologicly Atractive is just science trying to find an excuse for something that isn't really biological.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wolfgangh wrote:
But then again thats a matter larley of taste, one of the biggest pay for porn sites on the net is a Milf site (Mother I'd like to ****) Sorry but I think the term Biologicly Atractive is just science trying to find an excuse for something that isn't really biological.


I can't follow your reasoning. How is a "MILF" porno site relevant to biology? (Also how do you conclude that a particular site is "one of the biggest", and what are your criteria?)

What is the "thing" you say science is finding an "excuse" for anyway? (I would have said scientists are not in the "excuse" business.)

To expand on my earlier point: the reason for sex existing is to have babies. Younger woman = more fertile = more instinctively attractive. It's not the whole story of attraction (we are not animals), but it is wired into you somewhere due to millions of years of evolution.

- mib
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chocobahn
Mint Blancmanche


Joined: 26 Apr 2005
Posts: 1531
Location: Planet Earth. Or there about.

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
First of all, let me say that banning pornographic animation that depicts young girls will NOT stop people from committing any indecent acts against children. Same thing with banning drugs won't stop people from becoming a drug addict, or banning gun won’t stop people from killing each other.

Having said that, the government has a responsibility to ensure that our society has adequate protection against what the majority of the citizens deem as “undesirable” and “harmful”. Therefore, that’s why guns and drugs are banned.

I believe 99.9% of people who watch anime or play games that depict young girls in sexual acts do not have the tendency to commit crimes against young girls. It is the 0.1% that is the problem.

The thing is even if the government do decide to ban hentai animation that depicts young girls (and by that, under the age of 18 ), someone will find a loophole somewhere. The companies can state that the characters in their products are all over 18, even though they look much younger. Unless the law specifically says that the animated character cannot look like younger than 18, then it’s pretty much pointless. And even then, the ‘age’ factor is very subjective. Unlike real life, anime characters do not have any identification that says that they are so-and-so years old.

The other thing is, exactly WHAT are they going to ban? I don’t see how they can enact the law.
_________________
456 hours of unwatched anime DVDs
126 volumes of unread manga

Go on, touch me. You know you want it.
Latest games sales figures, plus new, weird and cheap games.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Greoboruri
Nene Romanova


Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 2357
Location: QBN

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
mib wrote:
You actually think animation of graphical sexual acts featuring pre-pubescents is fine? Just because "there may not be any solid evidence that watching it will make you more likely to actually rape a child?"


I don't like it one bit, but banning it isn't going to stop paedophilia is it now? You've got to daft to believe that. These groups trying to ban this stuff miss the point. You have to fix the cause of the problem, not the effects of it. You can ban lolicon for all I care, but it's not going to change a damn thing. Paedophiles will still exist. Some men will still rape little girls and kill them. Banning this stuff does not stop people who want to do this.

mib wrote:
For one there appears to be, in Japan, a growing weight of evidence that watching that kind of stuff does make you more likely to commit pedophilia. You say that's because those people already had those tendencies: even if that were true, so what? If by denying people access to lolicon anime we stop them tipping over the edge from fantasy to crime, that sounds like a damn good thing.


You've missed the point completely. Lolicon exists because there is a market for it. People with those tendancies are drawn to it. People aren't turned towards paedophilia by it. Mental health care in Japan is pretty horrid. What they should be doing is trying to help these people instead of demonizing them. Like it or not paedophiles are a part of society, and believe it or not a lot of them don’t like what they are and want to change. Acting with your raw emotions instead of actually thinking out the problem doesn’t help. It only makes the situation worse. Despite what mib says, there is no credible evidence to suggest that viewing this stuff will cause ordinary people to become paedophiles. What needs to happen is better education in Japanese schools directed towards boys how to treat women with respect and better mental health care.

Acting like you’re a crappy right-wing tabloid journalist out to provoke moral outrage doesn’t solve a damn thing and never has.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Greoboruri wrote:
I don't like it one bit, but banning it isn't going to stop paedophilia is it now?


Let me ask again. Do you actually think anime depicting graphical sexual acts involving children is fine? If not, why are you arguing against banning it?

That's really the crux of the matter here, and in fact the rest of this post is irrelevant, but I'll respond anyway.


Of course it's not going to stop pedophilia. Who said it would, or that was even the idea? Banning lolicon anime will certainly do a lot of good and no harm. That seems like a fine justification to me.

By your argument all laws should be done away with because they won't completely eliminate any particular problem.

Quote:
These groups trying to ban this stuff miss the point.


No, I think they hit the point quite well. Not allowing people access to this stuff is better for the people and better for society. That's their argument, and they are right.

Quote:
Lolicon exists because there is a market for it. People with those tendancies are drawn to it. People aren't turned towards paedophilia by it.


I see growing evidence that it encourages stronger tendencies in those who may otherwise have never gone further with them, and that in fact easy availability of pedophilic materials in Japan is part of an increase in not only pedophilic tendencies but actual crimes. Much of this is, I admit, circumstantial. But why take a risk with kids when there's nothing to lose?

Quote:
Mental health care in Japan is pretty horrid.


If this is a mental health issue, regardless of the state of the system in Japan removing access to the porn helps those who are sick.

Quote:
Acting with your raw emotions instead of actually thinking out the problem doesn’t help.


What, thinking child pornography anime is sick means I haven't though about the problem? I assure you that I have.

Quote:
Despite what mib says, there is no credible evidence to suggest that viewing this stuff will cause ordinary people to become paedophiles.


I never said that. Please try not to misrepresent my statements. Ordinary people are hardly likely to be watching it anyway.

Quote:
Acting like you’re a crappy right-wing tabloid journalist out to provoke moral outrage doesn’t solve a damn thing and never has.


Your blatantly trolling and emotionally manipulative insult does nothing to improve your already dwindling credibility.

- mib

(p.s. Arguing for the good of society over blatant self-interest is not "right wing".)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Raven Xavier
Usagi Tsukino


Joined: 08 Jun 2004
Posts: 2625
Location: somewhere over the rainbow

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
my mind is split on this subject. i myself am not a fan of lollycon but i know there are those on this site even who are. i think those who develope a liking of it through anime will be unneffected. however those whom are alreday having a fetish with young girls that come to lollycon to escape the laws will.
_________________
blog
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Benza
Banned


Joined: 27 Oct 2003
Posts: 15571
Location: Brisbane

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mib wrote:
Wolfgangh wrote:
But then again thats a matter larley of taste, one of the biggest pay for porn sites on the net is a Milf site (Mother I'd like to ****) Sorry but I think the term Biologicly Atractive is just science trying to find an excuse for something that isn't really biological.


I can't follow your reasoning. How is a "MILF" porno site relevant to biology? (Also how do you conclude that a particular site is "one of the biggest", and what are your criteria?)

What is the "thing" you say science is finding an "excuse" for anyway? (I would have said scientists are not in the "excuse" business.)

To expand on my earlier point: the reason for sex existing is to have babies. Younger woman = more fertile = more instinctively attractive. It's not the whole story of attraction (we are not animals), but it is wired into you somewhere due to millions of years of evolution.

- mib


Ok yeah I wasn't exactly clear, I really couldn't think of a good way to word it, But I think saying that the diffrence between the so called 'cute' girls and the 'homly' girls as you put it being so slight in asian countries is really completly irellivent. And their are many many people that think diffrently, I can't remember were I heard the statistic about it being the biggest site, it was on some porno review site that had a fox for a logo Very Happy So you know its gotta be acurate... right Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
HeDanny
Grumpy Old Man


Joined: 23 Jun 2004
Posts: 3415
Location: Sale, Vic

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
the freedom of expression issue again eh? Usually a hot topic for discussion. Keep it up peeps, its made for good reading so far.

Just one question. When talking about under age, are we talking Australian or japanese? I seem to recall (and I may to totally off the mark) that 12 and up was considered of age over there, yet here in Aus it was some stupid age like 14 and nine months, or some rubbish.

Expanding this, is there really anime out there that involves sex with children under even 12? And worse still, non-consentual etc depictions? Jesus. THats pretty.. disturbing. Sure as hell glad I have never seen any of that.
_________________
XBL | SEN (PSN) | Steam
School Spirit - the Web Comic
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
mib
Ayeka Masaki Jurai


Joined: 04 Nov 2001
Posts: 6463

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wolfgangh wrote:
But I think saying that the diffrence between the so called 'cute' girls and the 'homly' girls as you put it being so slight in asian countries is really completly irellivent.


Oh, right. Sure was... a cheap shot based on my personal preferences and observations. Completely opinion. I think that's why I bracketed it originally.

HeDanny wrote:
I seem to recall (and I may to totally off the mark) that 12 and up was considered of age over there


I am reliably informed[1] that while the age of consent there is 13, there are various other country-wide and regional laws that mean it is in reality more like 17 or 18. I don't know the details but hopefully they take into account the age difference between the participants. I assume non-consensual sex is illegal in Japan just like everywhere else civilised.

Quote:
is there really anime out there that involves sex with children under even 12? And worse still, non-consentual etc depictions?


Sadly, yes. Apparently 12 is way too old for most of the fetishists anway. Sad

- mib

[1] Please nobody attempt to claim that knowing this means I am a pedophile, that would be stupid.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
drae
Kenshin Himura


Joined: 14 Apr 2005
Posts: 1083

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
In Japan, it used to be that you couldn't have paid sex with anyone under 17, and could have CONSENSUAL sex with people with anyone over 13. However apparently the law was repealed in the last few years. You're looking at 16 at least. In Australia it's been 16 years old concerning the age of consent for a long time. Just go to www.ageofconsent.com .

The point is well taken though, there are countries around with an age of consent of 12.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Greoboruri
Nene Romanova


Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 2357
Location: QBN

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
mib wrote:
Let me ask again. Do you actually think anime depicting graphical sexual acts involving children is fine? If not, why are you arguing against banning it?


I find it repulsive. I also find a lot of other porn repulsive and other media such as 1970's Italian cannibal film where animals are really killed and dismembered on screen and misogynistic and exploitation films.

So does this give me a right to go around saying we should ban these films? Do I have a right to tell other people what to watch and read? No I don't. And you don't have that right either.

mib wrote:
Of course it's not going to stop pedophilia. Who said it would, or that was even the idea?


Well if you actually read the article in the first place, you would understand that this is the thinking behind the group trying to ban lolicon stuff ("Such a situation makes our society more dangerous to girls," she said. "We've got to think about it before talking about freedom of expression."). It's completely moronic. My point is they should look at the cause of the problem and spend their time and money there. It's a waste of time and effort to go after something that is an effect of it.

mib wrote:
By your argument all laws should be done away with because they won't completely eliminate any particular problem."


Now your just being stupid. Australian laws are fine as they are. Banning stuff which complies with laws is stupid and an insult against my inteligence and every other Australian adult.

mib wrote:
(p.s. Arguing for the good of society over blatant self-interest is not "right wing".)


Funny, this is what right wing Christian groups like the Australian Family Association always say. Sorry, but I don't see how trying to ban films like "Birth", "Lolita", "Baise Moi" and "Ken Park" will help Australian society. Sorry but I'm not a Christian, and lot of other Australian aren't either, so butt out of my life.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Nargun
Siegfried Kircheis


Joined: 30 Aug 2001
Posts: 4804
Location: \relax{}

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Greoboruri wrote:
Now your just being stupid. Australian laws are fine as they are. Banning stuff which complies with laws is stupid and an insult against my inteligence and every other Australian adult.


I find this post amusing. In a sort of "My, what a feeble-minded creature is man" sort of way, but it's that or drown in sorrow.

Because, see, this is a discussion about a Japanese proposal to change Japanese law to ban--in Japan--material that is *already* illegal in Australia.

It has no effect on what is and is not illegal in australia. If you thought that australian law was already perfect, you would *support* this change.

You claim to have read the article, yet you have not worked this out. I have not read the article, and yet I KNOW MORE THAN YOU. Clearly, reading the article didn't do your understanding of the situation a blind bit of good.

For your own sake, I suggest you either rectify this situation or cease disagreeing with people.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
StorminNorman
Gillard-chan


Joined: 15 Aug 2001
Posts: 22106
Location: Tolmekia

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Because of some of the stupid comments people made in this thread, we lost one of the more intelligent madboarders.

Thanks guys. I hope you're all happy.

End of thread.
_________________
XBL: Tamaaya | PSN: Stormo | Steam/GameCenter: StorminNorman | Stormo Plays Games
save your tears for the day when our pain is far behind
fast and free follow me we are soldiers stand or die
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:      

Page 1 of 1


Jump to:  

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum