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What would you like to see on Eastern Eye DVDs?



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What would you like to see on Eastern Eye DVDs?
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Chris
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Joined: 15 Oct 2003
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Location: Melbourne VIC, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 11:01 pm    Post subject: What would you like to see on Eastern Eye DVDs? Reply with quote
Hi there.

I'll be working on the authoring of a lot of the new Eastern Eye DVD releases, starting with Princess Blade. I'd be interested to hear if anyone has ideas on particular content they would like to see on an Eastern Eye DVD besides the movies; such as "extras" or particular kinds of information or text even (eg. filmographies, production notes, trivia maybe?). I'm thinking also along the lines of general rules of things to put on these DVDs (eg. like Madman has its Propaganda on its releases).

I'm not asking for suggestions for feature film acquisitions, just for DVD content. This can include ideas to do with the film itself though, such as multi-angle, streaming different release versions (local and international festival cuts perhaps). Anything that can be realistically achieved, given the limits of DVDs and licensing/acquisition of extras.

Any suggestions would be welcome. Smile
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Tachikoma
Shiki Tohno


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I was thinking along the lines of multi-angle stuff and DVD easter eggs. Perhaps a decent DVD-ROM content would be cool, like high resolution wall papers and/or the original sound tracks? (BTW, what about Hybrid DVDs where you can play the sound tracks in a standard CD player?)

Apart from that, I'm usually not very interested in extra contents. If it was up to me, I'd rater allocate more disc space for the main video title set.
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bardock
Sylia Stingray


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
personally the only extras i ever look at are scences that didnt make it into the final cut, i just dont get what people have with dvd extras is all about. the movie is the #1 thing and if they get that done then thats all i care about. i got out unforgiven(btw great movie imo) and as soon as i stuck the dvd into the dvd player it went straight to the film, no title screen, no extras just one kick ass movie and i didnt care one bit.
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Ranpha Franboise


Joined: 21 Jan 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
NO hard subs
Trailers, both english and japanese ones.
Music video if the movie has one.

90% off discount for madman dvds Razz
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jinsenblade
Mayuko Chigasaki


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think if it were possible, scripts as .pdf's for extra DVD rom content would be kind of cool.

- storyboard to movie comparison?
- I like commentaries.
- Interesting information I guess, like history, filmographies, bios on cast and crew would be interesting
- Original Trailers maybe ?
- Maybe an isolated soundtrack on the DVD itself?
- I'm the sort of person that enjoys interviews too. So that'd be great to put on there as extras.
- Documentraires would be a cool feature too. If possible.

I can't think of much more, extras wise. Just things that I guess build on and expand the movie.
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Remxi
Misa Amane


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Trailers for the feature and other Eastern Eye titles
Bio on the main characters/director (e.g. what films they were in etc.)
Pretty much any other extras that are easily available (e.g. extras that don't require a year of negotiation to get ^_^)
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Zedstar
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I ditto all of jisenblade's stuff.

I also really like if there are different regional trailers for them to be shown too. Teasers etc.

I'm not so into bios- as they are usually really hard to read from a tv screen anyway, but I do like filmographys and very brief bios.

Behind the scenes features tend to interest me too.

I adore OutTakes and Deleted scenes.. particularly when there's the director's commentary to explain why the deleted scenes weren't used.

^_^ Zedstar
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StorminNorman
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
SOFT SUBTITLES.

The reason I don't get Madman Cinema releases is because they're always hard-subbed.

This is important.
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bardock
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 10:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
whats the difference between soft and hard subbed? oh yeah and now that i think of it, if they already arent could the subtitles be yellow or atleast the option to turn them yellow as i hate white subtitles since they're way harder to read.
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Kermi
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Oh god, if Volcano High has white subtitles we won't be able to read anything for a whole scene somewhere in the middle.
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mangadude
Isamu Dyson


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hard subbed I believe is when the subtitles are permeantly glued to the screen and so you obviously can't remove them. I also wish for soft subs as well as these features:

Deleted scenes
Numerous trailers
making of featurettes
Cast, staff, character bios
music videos (why not?)
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Slykura
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm more than certain Volcano High will have soft subs, since there's materials for it, but yeah it's definately something thats NEEEDED.
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Chris
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I've actually already done the subs for Volcano High and Princess Blade. They'll be soft subs (ie. you can turn them off) - yellow with black outline in regular Arial font. I want to keep this consistent with all Eastern Eye titles.

Some video assets for foreign titles under Madman Cinema have had "hard subtitles" in the past. I prefer to avoid this.
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Kermi
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Awesome.
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StorminNorman
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
bardock wrote:
whats the difference between soft and hard subbed?


DVD "soft" subtitles are subtitles stored on the DVD seperate to the main video stream. They are run-length encoded 3-colour bitmap images. Basically, they're the subtitles you can turn on and off with your DVD remote, or from a DVD's setup menus.

"Hard" subtitles are subtitles on the main video stream itself. Basically when you watch SBS, the shows are "hard" subtitled in this manner (you can't turn them off, and they're part of the video stream). The problem with them is that they cannot be removed, and thus prevent you from ever watching the original video stream. Worse, MPEG compression tends to make a bit of a meal out of them, and you wind up with some fairly ugly artifacting around the subtitle area. This is very evident in Ring, and also Amelie, the local release of which is hardsubbed.

Soft subtitles suffer none of these problems, as they are not compressed within the video stream, rather overlayed on top of it when the player sends out the video data.

I've oversimplified this a bit, but I don't feel like going into how DVD streams work at this point, as its ridiculously complex and will only make you realise just how brain-damaged some parts of the DVD spec actually are.
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Zedstar
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I would like to say a big THANKYOU for the Yellow with black outline for subtitles.

I remember when SBS was the only place that did them, they're the best way a subtitle can be.

^_^ Zedstar
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jinsenblade
Mayuko Chigasaki


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is also just a suggestion but, I think in the credits (where they have who produced it, encoded etc.), it'd be kinda cool to have like the names of the members who may have suggested the title.

Its a cheap thrill to see your name. I don't know if that's possible, but that'd totally rock. Just a thought...
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Tachikoma
Shiki Tohno


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have to agree with Stormo about the subtitles:

- They must be removable/changeable for the main Video Title Set.

- Program User Prohibitions must be disabled for subtitle changing.

- Make them a nice Arial or Verdana font, and yellow with black outlines. The SBS style is probably the best.

- Make them a readable size. Again, SBS is on the money.
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jinsenblade
Mayuko Chigasaki


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Chris wrote:
I've actually already done the subs for Volcano High and Princess Blade. They'll be soft subs (ie. you can turn them off) - yellow with black outline in regular Arial font. I want to keep this consistent with all Eastern Eye titles.

Some video assets for foreign titles under Madman Cinema have had "hard subtitles" in the past. I prefer to avoid this.


Looks like Chris has taken that on board Smile
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Fuhrur
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Something that explains the context of the film. Including stuff like the year it was made, who made it and a little about how it came into production. I don't like watching a film and knowing very little about where/how/why it was made. That's why I liked the SBS introductions to films.
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mangadude
Isamu Dyson


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2003 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Fuhrur wrote:
Something that explains the context of the film. Including stuff like the year it was made, who made it and a little about how it came into production. I don't like watching a film and knowing very little about where/how/why it was made. That's why I liked the SBS introductions to films.
What would be really cool is if Madman acquired the services of Des Mangan to personally introduce each movie Very Happy
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jinsenblade
Mayuko Chigasaki


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Now that would set the DVD's apart from the rest Smile
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Tachikoma
Shiki Tohno


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
What would be really cool is if Madman acquired the services of Des Mangan to personally introduce each movie

**** yeah! Cool
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jinsenblade
Mayuko Chigasaki


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Oh, and I think on your first couple of DVD's... or whichever a little documentary piece on Eastern Eye itself would be interesting. I want to know who to buy a drink for, if I see you guys in the street Wink
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Zedstar
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2003 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
You could just go into the MM offices and say- "I would like to purchase drinks for (insert name/s here) please!"

I think everyone there would appreciate it.

^_^ Zedstar
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soma
Minawa Andou


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2003 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm a sucker for extras. I think Criterion pretty much lead the field in this.
What I'd like to see (in order of preference):

- Documentary on the film / making of the film
- Interviews with director/stars
- Director commentary
- Trailers (both for the film itself and others in the range coming soon)
- Deleted scenes
- Filmographies
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Zedstar
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2003 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
soma wrote:
I'm a sucker for extras. I think Criterion pretty much lead the field in this.


*nods vigorously*

Yes... A relationship with Criterion would make me very *very* happy.

^_^ Zedstar
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Mister Gil
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:53 am    Post subject: Pretty much what everyone said so far Reply with quote
including the request of NO HARD Subtitles. All subs should be optional, even if it's for translations of signs. Just create a separate subtitle track for translation of written text and stuff. And of course, digitally remastered video and audio and all of that. Very Happy

But what is MOST important is that all the releases under the Eastern Eye label be the fully UNCUT versions. Sadly the once great UK label HKL's are deciding to release the inferior international cuts of films like Musa and Volcano High which are all like 20-30 mins shorter than the original versions. Despite the fans outrage over it, they are still going ahead and releasing the cut versions.

If Eastern Eye can provide the fans with the versions that the original creators wanted us to see, then that alone will give wonderful hope for fans wanting to see their Asian films given the stellar treatment they deserve.

I hope that is already in mind over there at Eastern Eye.

Smile


This is Gil too...
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damien
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2003 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
If it's got a historical focus, like Seven Samurai, i'd love some background history as well.
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Sac
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 07, 2003 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Apart from SBS Style subs (which I read above you're already doing) I'd like very much to see trailers of other asians films, mostly becuase I know very little about them, apart from when I get lucky and catch a cool one on SBS.
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Mister Gil
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2003 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reading this again, Reply with quote
Quote:
I'm not asking for suggestions for feature film acquisitions, just for DVD content. This can include ideas to do with the film itself though, such as multi-angle, streaming different release versions (local and international festival cuts perhaps).


A streaming feature for different versions is actually not a bad idea come to think it. Smile However, it would only be worth it if it's actually seamless with no obvious annoying pauses in the film. If there would be obvious pauses in the presentation of the film then it's not worth it.





This is Gil too...
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Mr Waffle
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2003 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
When it comes to foreign films (aka not american), I like to know about the cast and the crew, since I usually haven't heard of them. So interviews with them are really good Smile
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Remxi
Misa Amane


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Just a small request, but if you're going to have two people talking at the same time, make sure that the subtitles are in different colours. It is extremely hard to understand what is going on when the two different subtitles kinda merge in with each other.
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Mr Waffle
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Remxi wrote:
Just a small request, but if you're going to have two people talking at the same time, make sure that the subtitles are in different colours. It is extremely hard to understand what is going on when the two different subtitles kinda merge in with each other.


Agreed. Especially if it is song lyrics...
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Chris
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
What about with how SBS do subs - using separate lines with leading hyphens? Personally, I like that method.

I agree with different coloured subs for song lyrics, but for different people talking I think it would be confusing to have occasional subtitles popping up in different colours. Let me know if you have seen any examples of this.

Another factor is the the basic DVD colour palette for subtitles is extremely limited.

ie.


That's it.

Most of these colours are crap becuase they're too murky (even the green's a little dull). Colour 8 (the yellow) is the best one. Colours 3, 5, 6 (white, lt grey, cyan) are the next best because they're still bright, but even these are not that great. I try to avoid using a second colour because there are no second colours that I like.
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Tachikoma
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
What about with how SBS do subs - using separate lines with leading hyphens? Personally, I like that method.

I agree with different coloured subs for song lyrics, but for different people talking I think it would be confusing to have occasional subtitles popping up in different colours.

I fully agree. Dialogue should be yellow, with hypens if approproate. Songs should be in white. However, I do like the multi-coloured text used in interviews (eg.: in Cowboy Bebop (I think Embarassed ) extras, with questions in white and answers in yellow).



edit: From memory, I think it is possible to redefine color palette for subpictures (well at least in Scenarist you can).
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Mr Waffle
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
If I recall correctly, Voices of a Distant Star had the song lyrics appear on the same lines as the text, which was very annoying. On most... er... unlicenced anime subs, the song lyrics appear at the top, so they won't interfere with the talking. I think that idea is far better.
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Remxi
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The subtitle placement on VoaDS was horrid, to the point where it seriously detracted from the viewing experience. Having song subtitles at the top is a great idea, especially if it's like an OP/ED theme with the romanised version at the top and the translated version at the bottom, the way most fansubs are done at the moment.
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Chris
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yi-Long wrote:
I think different colours would kinda 'clash' with the movie, ESPECIALLY with the serious movies or the black and white ones ( seven samurai, Yojimbo etc)
You can just indicate the moment a new person talks, with a simple '-' before the 2nd entence.

I'm thinking of going with white subs (with black outline) for black & white films such as Seven Samurai and Yojimbo. This is something that SBS does. What do other people think?

Yi-Long wrote:
Just a suggestion btw. but what about the coverart!?
I'm sure the art-department usually comes up witha couple of suggestions for the final look!? Would it be possible to maybe check what our prefered design would be!? Or are you thinking about, like with some anime titles, about double sided sleeves!?

I'm not sure what current thoughts are with sleeves. If you have any particular ideas or suggestions, feel free to make them. The Madboards are a good way for you to do this. Comments will be passed on. Cool

I'm off back home to Adelaide over Christmas. Everyone have a good Christmas! Smile
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Tachikoma
Shiki Tohno


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
I'm thinking of going with white subs (with black outline) for black & white films such as Seven Samurai and Yojimbo. This is something that SBS does. What do other people think?

Yep that's cool. (I was gonna mention that, too. )
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Zedstar
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Treating the films similarly to anime- I actually really like the idea of the double sleeves, so that if you don't particularly like the sleeve you can turn it inside out.

Keeping the black and white for black and white films is great, also if the films could be adjusted so that the film is slightly higher if letterboxed, allowing the subtitling to sit in the letterboxing.

^_^ Zedstar
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Tachikoma
Shiki Tohno


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
also if the films could be adjusted so that the film is slightly higher if letterboxed, allowing the subtitling to sit in the letterboxing.

That might cause problems if the film is pan & scanned by the TV or the DVD player.
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EbonP
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Chris wrote:
I'm thinking of going with white subs (with black outline) for black & white films such as Seven Samurai and Yojimbo. This is something that SBS does. What do other people think?


I recently watched Yojimbo on a video someone had taped off SBS a few years back and found that the white subtitles were hard to read in a few scenes where they were set against an almost white background, for example at the beginning of the film when the boy is leaving his parents home. Even with the black outline around the subs I had to rewind and strongly focus on the subs to be able to read them.
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EbonP
Misa Amane


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2003 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
There was definately a black outline on the subs, it was just that the outline was very thin. So maybe SBS just stuffed it up as you suggested?

Anyway if Chris decides to go with the white subs I'm sure he'll examine them himself to see how easy they are to read.
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kontkommer
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
most importantly i would like to see full director's cuts (no international cuts), nice anamorphic transfers, original audio streams in original format and literal translated subtitles.. if thats on a dvd i'm happy (:

extras are just extras but i love documentaries on legends like akira kurosawa, toshiro mifune, sonny chiba, kinji fukasaku etc..
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Shintaro Katsu
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
first things NO CUTS i hate not seeing the film as a director intended
2nd of all the only extras i really care for are deleted scenes & directors commentarys so if possible these will be great additions
other than them anything else i see as bonus stuff and is gladly welcome but i do prefer a dvd with extra scenes and commentary as anything else i find a bit pointless
all the other subtitle releated issues have been said by others so i think them
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Chris
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
EbonP wrote:
There was definately a black outline on the subs, it was just that the outline was very thin. So maybe SBS just stuffed it up as you suggested?

Anyway if Chris decides to go with the white subs I'm sure he'll examine them himself to see how easy they are to read.

Yeah, DVD subtitles actually support two levels of "outlines" around the letters. Definitely be using both levels to effectively have double-thickness black outlines on all subs.
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h8sh8
Doraemon


Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Posts: 9
Location: Geelong, Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 12:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
My preferences would be...

-Movie-
Full uncut version
Original Aspect Ratio
Original Audio
Literal translated Subs (the colours you've suggested - like SBS)
Remastered/Restored
Anamorphic
5.1/dts

-Extras (in order of preference)-
Commentaries (director, crew, cast, critics)
Extra scenes (if not in uncut movie)
Documentaries
Making of/behind the scenes

or whatever is most informative. As much text as possible.

Personally I think trailers aren't too informative and I'd only watch them once.

cheers, thanks for asking.
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napalm68
Lin Minmay


Joined: 12 Oct 2003
Posts: 234
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 7:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yeah, primarily that the versions are uncut Razz If you can only get cut versions then frankly do not bother releasing them. You will be cutting your market down somewhat (ie, fans of the actual movies/genre you are selling).

Picture - NO EDGE ENHANCEMENT! I do not appreciate technician induced haloing. This is a 100% avoidable artifact that ruins so many transfers it isn't funny.

Also, Original Aspect Ratio. Anamorphic. Best possible source material (only a print as a last resort Razz)

Also, make sure subs are well pisitioned. If anamorphic, make sure they appear in the black area if you are on a 4:3 tv. Sirens Jin Roh did this very very well I thought.

Maybe a nice extra feature basically free feature would be optional subtitle types/sizes. You have a big TV, have smaller font. Choose your colour. Costs hardly anything to do. Because seriously, the SBS style yellow subs give me the squirts. They stand out too much, and ruin the atmosphere in asian horror. Off white is my personal preference.

Other features I really like are Director interviews. However crappy they are (eg, like the director interview on Ninja Scroll SE, where it looked like it was taken in someones manga store during a fan signing Shocked)

Features I DON'T want to see are overcomplicated animated menus. Don't waste your time and money. If the menu options don't appear immediately and you have to wait for some godforsaken sequence to complete - AARRRRGGHHH!

Oh yeah, and no tricky stuff like making you go to the animated menu to change language/subs rather than just being able to scroll through the options with your player remote. That is annoying.
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Zedstar
Madboard Mod


Joined: 26 Mar 2001
Posts: 1845
Location: Too close for comfort.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2004 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I don't mind MINOR animated menus, but an extended animated sequence is very annoying, I also tend to use the dvd remote to flip through to the settings I want.

I would prefer if those functions are available.

^_^ Zedstar
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